Bell of Lost Souls - Latest Comments in Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

RTM — Sun, 12 Oct 2008 14:18:24 -0000

Before this thread disappears, I want to add one last request. . .

It would be nice to have a HS option that is an artillery team of tarantulas or rapiers. These are infrastructure defense equipment that fits better with Arbitrators and precinct/block homeland defense than any other army.

Tarantulas should be twin-linked BS2 HB/AC/LC/MM to cover all the standard kits over the years. Rapiers could be twin-linked multi-lasers with some kind of multi-penetrate rule against armor (to go with fluff), maybe for simple rules' sake make them rending. (S6 with rending is enough to sometimes breach decent armor, but it doesn't become unreasonably powerful in general use). Hell, you could call it an assault cannon to make life really easy, but if you did that I wouldn't make it BS2 twin linked.

Tarantulas and Rapiers should be able to move unlike some artillery pieces, since they are both supposed to be mobile defense platforms (legs or tracks, respectively). The crew should probably be 1 citi-def or servitor per platform, able to attach one proctor.

RTM

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Fatalitas — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 11:53:20 -0000

It would work in a fluff style campaign of a genestealer invasion. First step, the coven is uprising and tries to beat the local enforcers, ie adeptus arbites. You can go on and on and on by adding an imperial guard response, tyranid hive fleet coming in called by the patriarch, space marines, and so on, and starting with a little skirmish end up with an apocalypse battleground !

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Savark — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 04:54:29 -0000

stumped already

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

RTM — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 16:46:37 -0000

I still can't wait to see how the penal legion rules get offered up. I'm hoping for something like the cultists "unwashed masses" rules, where if they fail a Ld check they dissappear. Have "explosive collars" be an upgrade option for the unit at some set point cost (+15 points per unit, or whatever) that allows you to do any Ld re-roll at the cost of losing 1d6 models *ka-BOOM* to quickly bring the mob in line.

Great fun!

RTM

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

RTM — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 16:43:45 -0000

I forgot about that, thanks for the reminder.

Maybe a good medium is to have the basic Arbitrator BS4 so it's consistent with existing models/rules, and give the executioner round the ability to ignore or reduce cover? That minimizes dice rolling for the basic trooper and sticks true to all the fluff, makes the executioner do what it's supposed to do, and keeps a good game balance overall for what is still a mid-range basic trooper.

RTM

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Brainburner — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 12:28:58 -0000

Could you please add in the 'Gun-hound' version of the cyber-mastif. And possibly add in a conversion method for creating one.

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Slawson — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:44:43 -0000

I'd be pleased to just have a unit of 10 models for use with my Imp guard now and then.

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Brad-3492 — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 06:22:08 -0000

AA Land Speeders sound like a cool idea there the fluff (Eisenhorn Xeno i think) maybe give them the Land Speeder Storm as like a SWAT Helicopter

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Parcival — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 05:14:14 -0000

Ahem, could we please have that as wallpapers for our desktops as well? =)

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

faultie — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 00:28:42 -0000

I don't know. The current legal Arbites are BS4, and the fluff indicates that they are most often raised in Schola Progenium facilities, and then go through several years of Arbites training (as they mention in CrossFire and Ultramarines Omnibus, I think). BS4 is much more appropriate. As far as different types of bolters, the CJ29 list had normal bolters. Introducing different types now is silly (a lot of the older Sororitas models have old-school bolters, and they're still S4AP5.)

As for overpowered, it's hardly overpowered to have 18", S4 AP5 twin-linked on the standard trooper. I think they should also have CC weapon and pistol (as in the fluff), but that's not necessary.

Remember, when the Arbites list came out, and the arbites were 8 pts for BS3 troopers with Executioner rounds, it was in the era where Kasrkin stats were the same as they are now, but somewhere around 16 pts (Armageddon book is somewhere around here).

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

faultie — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 00:21:29 -0000

They already have Cybermastiffs. They're from the Necromunda set of Enforcers.

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Klownboy — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 20:38:15 -0000

Always like the term "Reeve" (similar derivation as Sheriff) as an office/rank title.

Back in the day I used Marneus Calgar's shoulder pads on my Arbites squad. Very Judge Dread-ey.

Another conversion option is the Cadian Veterans pack from Forgeworld. They have some different helmets and shotguns that look very SWAT.

It would be nice to see select fire ammo types for the leaders & characters too. I think their vehicles should be limited to Chimeras w/ turret variants, scout bikes, a cavalry mount option, Land Speeders, maybe unarmored Sentinels. Sentry guns might be justifiable, and how about heavy stubbers as a man portable LMG/Special weapon choice. And don't forget the snipers.

Maybe a Cityfight Strategem just for Arbites: "Precinct House". = Fortifications + Ammo Dump + Command Center .

But you guys are smarter than me.
Looking forward to it. I now have a place for my IG extras.

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

war009 — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:44:36 -0000

please don't forget heavy weapons (stubbers) and cyber mastiffs and the all impotant excutioner round

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Imperialsavant — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:35:41 -0000

Yes! I totally agree with paelkeizah, the Necromunda models are excellent.
I made a squad of 10 including a female model from (dare I say it?) another model manufacturer to represent Shira Calpurnia of "Crossfire" etc fame & included the Cybermastif for a bit of Fluff & use them with my WitchHunters Army with Sisters. You use the Stormtrooper Rules as per the Codex.
Any of you who belong to the Adeptus Arbites Garrison group on Yahoo can view them in my "gully_raker" Photo Album if you wish.
More Great Work by the Texas Lords! Looking forward to the finished Codex.

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Anon — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:16:42 -0000

Lol. indeed. I actually have some black marbles, which will one day be Umbra if I can figure out how to stick plastic to glass. Never had any luck with that :(

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Augie — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 19:01:32 -0000

While I do not always agree with the commentary, I find BoLS to very informative and helpful, way more that Games Workshop's paltry attempts. Congratulations on your continuing excellent achievement.

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

jasperflint — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 18:29:00 -0000

i was wondering how it would fit in but that's perfect. i would love to do something like that

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

RTM — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 18:16:31 -0000

Couple other things I was thinking about as reviewing other Arbiter lists over the ages (curse you for keeping me from doing Real Work). Consider the game balance of the executioner shells and arbiter bolters relative to their play. The executioner rounds with BS3 reroll misses 18" A1 S4 AP5 were pretty fierce, but it's simpler to just call them "BS4" arbitrators instead of BS3 reroll misses, or just give old BS3 troopers the benefit to ignore or mitigate cover (which is the original fluff purpose of the seeking rounds)

Also good to have two shoot styles, so that you can always use it as a regular shotgun 12" A2 S3 AP- depending on your target. Gives good interest and playability without overloading on rules and fiddly extra rolling.

Other things to consider are the size and effectiveness differences between old RT-era bolters (the size of modern bolt pistols) and modern bolters. You may wish to downgrade the kill team bolters to stump bolters (civilian bolters, stump guns, whatever have you), like what people have bandied about Necromunda wonk boards back in the day. Essentially same gun but AP6 instead of AP5. Still a great weapon, but not overpowering relative to other options, and helps equalize arbitrators (and their bikes) with the superior modern bulky MEQ armaments (noting also that modern bolters are more game-effective than bolters in the RT era).

Also another term for "Jurists" could be "Citi-Def" for you Old-Skoolers who like to run around collapsing hab-blocks. :-)

I would like to throw in a word of caution to carefully consider penal legions, or consider including two versions. There is a school of thought (since Witch Hunters book came out) that everyone who goes to jail turns into a super-elite assassin-like arco-killing maniac. The other school of thought is supported by people who put down two squads of 20 poor dumb a-holes in striped (or orange) shirts and run them head first into termagants. One of those types is going to be 12-20 points per model, the other one is going to be 3-5 points per model. I'm willing to bet that most arbiter players out there at this moment are fielding one or the other.

RTM

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Sam — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:57:09 -0000

HELLS YEAH!!!!

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

paelkeizah — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:31:27 -0000

just go buy the NECROMUNDA ENFORCERS! they are adeptus arbites after all and they have power muals suppression sheilds even the cyber mastiff (robotic doggy of death)

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Andrew — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:16:00 -0000

Ohhhh...

I think it moved...

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

WarHamster — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:09:38 -0000

great news!
i was thinking of doing an arbites list with the new sm codex and WH allies, but it was too frustrating.
"okay... those guys are the better shots, that's why they get special weapons"
"and those... yeah, they can't shoot as good, but they get better guns... right..."
man, i wish gw would make all shotguns s4 a2 :(

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

RTM — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 15:04:34 -0000

This is FANTASTIC news. My requests include:
1) being able to use Mordians (or Steel Legion) adjuncts in the list as troops units of "Jurists" or the equivalent. The Emperor's mall cops, if you will.
2) I have light Jurist jetbikes as part of my force, would be great to see these back in (scouts?) as well as the heavy SM-Scout style heavy judge bikes (which are sweet) or old-skool IG judge bikes. Many arbiter players should have a few (or one squad) of some kind of bike mounted justice.
3) Ensure we get rhinos and chimeras as transport options, with option to take Valkyries for when they become available.
4) Seconding previously mentioned suppressor (shock maul), kill teams (bolters+heavy), and swat (infiltrating snipers) team options
5) Grot/conscript-like penal legion (flak vest at most for armor, since most people seem to use Catachans to bulk out their prisoners) with non-sucky non-fiddly rules for human bombs that are clean and work.
6) Robodog K9 unit with conversion suggestions (cyber up a kroot hound? Don't know...what about new plastic chaos hounds? Easier to convert)
7) Give us vehicles that look and play similar or equivalent to likely SoB and IG vehicles people will already be using in their armies.
8) Units and apocalypse formations that are not as restrictive and limited like the GS Cult versions. There are a lot of different arbiter armies out there, and we've all shoehorned them into existing rules in different ways.

Not to sound bossy or anything, consider me "highly interested and helpful". I'd be happy to go on a playtest list for this one since I missed the GS Cultist leet-dood list by one slot. :-(

RTM

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

EmperorsWrath — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 13:52:30 -0000

Please build this Codex so that it utilizes the models that GW made for this range in addition to conversions (Jes' bolter and shotgun squads with access to all four IG special weapons, plus the 2nd generation models that came out for Fanatic). Make sure all of the truly released metals are usable, since that's what people own. Any conversion squads like bikers from the new scouts are cool, but the important thing is: don't make any of the GW metals obsolete. We have enough problems when GW makes things obsolete, the fans shouldn't be adding to the problem [cough]...Genestealer Cult Codex...[cough cough]

Re: Bigred and Bulwark are working...

Herald of Nurgle — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 13:37:27 -0000

*ALL HAIL THE ARBITES*
Seriously, I appreciate this. Finally I can get the cops down on their establishments!