Bell of Lost Souls - Latest Comments in Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Tynskel — Tue, 12 Jan 2010 17:13:01 -0000

Ah, but there is a precedent in the rules.

Every time the "May reroll any failed to hit rolls in close combat" has been made vs vehicles, Games Workshop has come out with a FAQ stating that only WS counts. This has happened THREE TIMES to the Space Wolves- 3rd edition Codex, in the 4th Edition Codex (space marines supplement) and now in the 5th Edition Codex.

Because of the Precedent, the argument for anyone to abuse that rule against vehicles without a WS is null. Another example: Counter-Attack and Furious Charge, the new Space Wolf FAQ states that counter-attack counts as charging. Now that has become the norm for all armies.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Sathos — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 11:48:30 -0000

I didnt mention a reroll, I added the attack squig off the top of my head as an example instead ;)
as an extra dice can be just as good as getting an extra hit on a reroll :)

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

nojinx — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:41:54 -0000

Yup, that's the one. You tabled a good friend of mine in the first round (SM player). Nice work, and good luck in Sacramento!

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Zen_Paladin — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 09:59:00 -0000

Yeah read up a bit. Aparently a guy with max destroyers took first at some location.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Sathos — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 06:30:07 -0000

Uusally the wording on the reroll is "May reroll any failed to hit rolls in close combat" or similar
so there isnt any discussion...its only "reroll failed to wound" rolls I could see even coming close
to debate :)

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

luculluslegio — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 00:36:38 -0000

Yeah I think I am going to make a bunch of rhino and drop pod shaped craters to take with me from now on.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

lordazaneal — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 00:25:16 -0000

C tan as hq max destroyers and hvy destroyers rest points in warior squads

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

BuFFo — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 22:21:08 -0000

No, it was a Deamon Player. Its even up on the page where you find the 'Ard Boyz rules on GW's site.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

BuFFo — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 22:20:24 -0000

Cool, I understand you know.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Spacelizard — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 22:10:37 -0000

I know he ran Calgar, an Ironclad, 1-2 quad PC Dev Squads, squadron of 3 land speeder Typhoons, the rest Tac squads. Not too sure about the rest of the makeup as I did not play him thats just what I saw from glancing at the table.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

FreemanAIT — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:17:22 -0000

Whoops forgot there is a whirlwind in there as well.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

FreemanAIT — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:16:33 -0000

Combat squads, that's four scoring. Razorbacks allow for a 4+ turn rush. Was it against 9 speeders? That many are hard to put down. You only get one/two turns to put them down before they cause serious damage. The missile squad offer great stand off fire power while the other speeders can move 12'' and still be effective with one weapons because its twin linked. Also the speeders can be held and deep striked to let them get first licks on a gun line. 2 twin auto on a dread sounds crappy but as I learned twice it gives on average 3-4 str 7 a turn so the gun line can't be ignored. The tacs keep there head down and contribute with heavy weapons and razor twin bolters. Calgar, god bless him doesn't give the same weapons boost. The army has 6 twin Hv flamers and Multi-melta and enough missile, auto and hv bolter flank to turn your stomach. It has 8 auto, 6 missile and 27 Hv bolter shoots per turn before you count Vulcan and the squads. The auto/bolter pred cost 85pts and take a dogs beating to knockout/silence or stopped from being a shield. A termi squad costs 200 before upgrades and will be evaporated by ap2 weapons or if called to make enough saves. Termi gun lines are like a gold handle on a glass hammer. Pretty but not cost effective. It's not my list so I wouldn't take offense but I think its a sleeping giant. You need luck to beat this army because he doesn't. I say this while playing full mech eldar lead by Eldrad.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

joshuadearth — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:40:20 -0000

How did this guy claim objectives? Half the bonus points on most of the scenarios would be denied this guy if his two tac squads go down. While it sounds like a nice list I don't think it could handle being pinned down while the speeders recieved focus fire! If the speeders go and the tac squads dissapear I don't see this list doing a whole lot of anything really. I mean no offense by this, I just don't think it is as powerful as it is being made out to be. I say this because I faced a similar list with Calgar instead of Vulcan and a 10 man gun line termie squad instead of the predators. Other than that it was pretty much the same list and was tabled by turn 5 with minimal losses returned. THe terminators were pinned for all but the first turn of the game and never did anything. The speeders went down early and then it was just focus fire on the squads. That is my thoughts for what it is worth. Again I mean no offense by this.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

A Little Perspective — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:29:29 -0000

Do you know the rough make-up of the gunline marine list that came first?

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Daniel — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:07:54 -0000

The problem is 3 rounds is not enough to get a true result based on swiss style pairings. If they made it a 2 day 6 round event then I think you'd see vindication for the guy who consistently majors-but-never-massacres people. And it would minimize the impact of a player massacring his first round scrub opponent and being able to coast his later rounds and still get top 3.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

moonreaper — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 19:58:56 -0000

Anyone seen any necrons ?
I read Tau got second at one tour But I havent seen any necrons .

Were there anyone playing them at least?

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Fuegan17 — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 19:47:55 -0000

hey, I think those orks were me. Game Kastle location right?

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

SoonerBrian — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 19:02:50 -0000

Oh, our top three were #1) Dark Eldar, #2) Doublewing, #3) Mech Eldar w/ Eldrad and Yriel

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

SoonerBrian — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:59:39 -0000

To be clear, our organizer DID group winners versus winners. I just wanted to include that because I wasn't sure how they grouped at other locations.

I have no problems with people bringing killer lists -- I can say that I've never been accused of being a soft hearted player. :) My concern is that in the last two Ard Boyz tournaments we've seen a player take first and somehow manage to avoid playing anyone decent until the last game. And I've seen frustrated players (who managed to win every game they played) sit and say "But I would stomp this guy's list..."

So, seeing this two years in a row, I think there's an inherent flaw in the way they calculate points. It's too easy to build a huge lead early against a player who might play one game every six months. And that's a problem.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

sergentzimm — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:58:08 -0000

Yeah at the end of the game there were like 8 or 9 vehicles that I had killed on a 6. It was crazy.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

SoonerBrian — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:48:30 -0000

I play in Oklahoma City. I figure it's the same at a lot of stores.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

RealGenius — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:08:05 -0000

Right, Kings, over 2 games-- obviously 18 is too many for one army.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

FreemanAIT — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:06:39 -0000

At a local tournament on the weekend and codex marines may be the new king of the hill. A guy brought a sallies army with Vulcan, 9 land speeders (6 melta-flame, 3 missile-bolt), 2 predator auto-bolt, dreadnought twin auto and 2 ten man tac squads with basic razorbacks. It was unstoppable. Twin linked flamer/meltas on speeders gave guaranteed kill on any target. Other vehicles gave an unyielding deluge of fire. Anything not blown or burn to bits finished by tac squads and Vulcan. 14 armour, high toughness, holofields, overwhelming numbers all easily countered. Vs daemons, 2 land raider marines, mech Eldar, mech dark Eldar, Armoured guard. It massacred without breaking a sweat. If this list takes off, you heard it here first and it was created by a guy called Frank. Be afraid of codex marines, very afraid.

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Brent — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:56:15 -0000

I suspect we all do...

Re: Goatboy's 40k Thoughts: No Ard Boyz for me.

Spacelizard — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:20:24 -0000

San Angelo, Tx Results:

out of 16 players
1st Marines - Gunline /Ultramarines
2nd Marines - Mech/ Vulkan (myself)
3rd IG - Mech/*not sure of the makup other than i saw lots of tanks

My day:
Round1 - vs Thousand Sons
He had Ahirman and 4 TS squads, Raptors w/ MoT, and 2 Havoc squads w/MoT. This was a Minor Victory for me and would have been a Massacre if one of my tactical squads had been 1" closer to the objective when the game ended. Rhinos protected my scoring units from AP3 bolters, in fact I think there was only one time that one of my scoring units got shot with inferno bolts and that was my tac squad without a transport that was camping one of my own objectives in cover so losses were minimal. Secondly, I got lucky and the psychic hood from my librarian prevented all but 1 of Ahirman's psychic powers from hurting me the entire game. Continuing with the Librarian, Null zone + Melta weapons made short work of TS since they had to reroll their invuln saves.

Round2 - Eldar
Eldrad+Avatar list w/ 3 War Walkers, 2 ranger quads, 1 guardian squad, 2 dire avenger squads, 2 dark reaper squads, 1 unit of harlequins, possibly another squad of something .. cant remember. My first thinking was both of my HQs need to be up close to be effective, but eldrad can be 100% effective just sitting in the back, and his avatar is immune to all my flamers and meltas. I actually deployed my librarian with a tac squad in cover that had no line of sight at all and left them there the entire game, they literally did nothing the entire game. I made the mistake of disembarking vulkan and his terminators to assault a dire avenger squad that were blade storming my tactical squad. The reason I did this was that I was going for the battle point for having more troops in his deployment zone. The Dire Avengers failed their Ldr ship test from shooting from the tactical squad and thus Vulkan and the terminators had nothing to assault. The following turn I lose two Terminators to shooting and then the squad gets assaulted by harlequins. The combat begins with 5 close combat terminators and vulkan against a full squad of harlequins. At the end of 4 rounds of combat all that stands is Vulkan with 1 wound left, this meant that in the following turn vulkan would be out in the open against 2 star cannons from war walkers, a bright lance from the guardians and a dark reaper squad. I managed to roll a 6 for my consolidation move which was just enough to move vulkan behind my land raider and out of LOS of his entire army. Luckily his avatar got stuck in close combat with one of my drop podded dreads for the majority of the game and was not a major threat. In the end we came to a Tie with 8 Kill points each but I was able to score 1 extra point for having more troops in his deployment zone.

Round 3 - Imperial Guard
I was facing 2 30 strong platoons w/ command squads, 4 chimeras full of hardened vets, a quad of 2 leman russes w/ battle cannons, one leman rus with a demolisher, a basilisk, Col. Straken & command squad, and 2 heavy weapons teams. He went first and first turn first shot wiped out my entire bike squad with his basilisk. In my first turn my Dread with MM and heavy flamer droppodded in right behind his basilisk and scored an immobilized with the Multi Melta and a Vehicle explodes with the heavy flamer. During his first turn he sent one of his platoons and one of the hardened vet squads after one objective and 3 of his hardened vet squads and a platoon after the other. I took minor losses throughout the game only losing the bike squad and two rhinos. On the objective that he sent less troops at. I was able to make his chimera explode from a krak missle and he lost half his squad from the explosion. the platoon that was camping on the objective lost half of its men from flamer and combi flamer from one squad in one round of shooting plus a few more from bolter fire where he had a cover save. My tac squad wiped out his entire platoon with just 3 flamer shots due to the way the terrain was modeled. On the other side of the board I was able to pop all but one of his transports with my Land raider and he took massive losses from Vehicle explodes results. The guys that were left were quickly wiped up from flamers out of the top hatch of a rhino. In the end I walked away with an easy Massacre, however I would have to say that Vulkan's twin linking of melta and flamer weapons 100% won me the game.