DISQUS

BFT · 1 year ago

this is a general thing, could you post a list of often used abreviations somewhere on the site. I just started coming here and at times don't know whats bieng talked about.

for example- MEQ's???

~Thanks!

BrassScorpion · 1 year ago

A glossary would be helpful. I often find abbreviations on forums a bit mystifying myself.

As for MEQ, this one I know, it's "Marine Equivalent". It means anything in the game that is exactly like or close to being like Space Marines regarding game statistics. This generally refers to Toughness 4, armor save 3+ type troops.

Here's another one you'll see a lot, ATSKNF, which is shorthand for "And They Shall Know No Fear".

NeilBrimelow · 1 year ago

How much are Thunder Hammers and Storm Shields? Jeez, please post the points cost per Terminator and Thunder Hammer/SS.

Endless · 1 year ago

Another Q: Do the marines 16 pt cost include wargear similar to the chaos marines? (melee weapon, grenades, etc.)?

k2vsate · 1 year ago

bolter, bp, frag,krak iirc. No melee weapon.

k2vsate · 1 year ago

40pts for assault termies regardless of kit.

NeilBrimelow · 1 year ago

Wow, that's farking cheap! So pretty much the only thing in the game that could now dislodge 10 Assault Terminators would be what? The Nightbringer? Lol! I think TWO Nightbringers against 10 Thunder Hammer/SS terminators would be a fair fight. :)

Yeah, yeah, I know Terminators can't claim objectives, etc, and I am certainly not complaining, but there are few things in the game that can stand up to the "new" assualt terminators in HTH.

I am actually glad GW made the Thunder Hammer/SS BADASS again.

General Boredom · 1 year ago

Nightbringer ignores armour saves, even invulnerable ones :)

NeilBrimelow · 1 year ago

exactly! but 10 terminators could beat the shite out of the nightbringer. :)

UltramarineFan · 1 year ago

After all there are only so many attacks a nightbringer can have

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

The deathwing termies can claim objectives with Belial.

Republican Marine · 1 year ago

Deathwing is Darkangel only...and likely wont be subject to the SM rules...or so the rumor goes.

TemplarsMonochromata · 1 year ago

Greetings from WEEEEELLINGTON, Bitcha!
Thankyou white Dwarf, I just finally finished my squad of shooty termies, FINALLY.

My sorry old SH + TH forgeworld beaky termies were shelf surfing for so many months of uselessness... I predicted that in order to make the TH + SS combo more worth while, either landraiders would get bigger, or stormshields would get better.
Totally called that one, but 3+ global? AWESOME.

K2vSate? Give us a yell and visit us in wellington ey?

k2vsate · 1 year ago

^^ I can do that but you really need to tell me who you are because I do not remember that user name. In Wellington for FoB btw.

Nork's Minis · 1 year ago

LOL Blade Runner... my favorite movie.

stephen · 1 year ago

I don't no.I managed to build a marine list with the new rules with almost 90 models in it.Its possible in 2000 pts.

jasperflint · 1 year ago

with 2000 points you could get 300 orks, enough to cause any army some trouble

Medium Dave · 1 year ago

Sounds good, I can't wait.

stephen · 1 year ago

I like the fact that they force you to take a ten man squad to get two hvy weapons in a termie squad.
You can switch the lighting claws for hammer and shield and YES!!!!3+save with it

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

Does this mean there are 10-man termie squads?

Buggus · 1 year ago

What you termy guys fail to understand is that saves really dont matter that much in 5th ed. Let along the amount of high str/ranged weapon that are in the other armies. Oh ya you can load them up in a crusader, oh wait that the bulk of your army in just two units. Termies need FNP or at least a four plus reg inv save.

Nick · 1 year ago

dude, termies can get 3+ inv saves with storm shields
and they can exchange their normal weapons for a thunder hammer and ss combo... so... they have better than a 4+ reg inv save. This is only the assault termies though... and i see what you mean about the high toughness weaponry

Zweig · 1 year ago

Can sternguard be deployed in pods or rhino's?

This codex is making it look more and more like GW hates DA/BA players changing all this wargear (why does BA/DA PoTMS fire at BS 2 and ultramarines at BS4).

Phil please buddy, FAQ IN THE WARGEAR FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THE BABY KITTENS IN THE WORLD

k2vsate · 1 year ago

IIRC yes, I am pretty sure everything in the marine army gets transport options now except maybe tech marines.

Sarpedon · 1 year ago

Yeah, I went in to my local store about 5 hrs ago, and asked about the release date.

One of my friends who works there said he didn't know, but that i could spend some quality bonding time with the advance copy the store(he) gets.

I love it. That's all there is to it. You would not believe how thick and heavy it feels in your hands. The artwork is stunning. Both the B&W and colored images. I didn't get to look int actual points costs and new units, as i had limited time with it(10 mins, as my mother(i admit it) has no idea of the extraordinary import of this situation) but all I saw looked great.

baronvoncarson · 1 year ago

I am really excited about this codex. Finally they'll live up to the their fluff! As a Xeno player I'm looking forward to some fun and challenging games at my local club. It's shaping up to be a good "first" 5th edition codex.

Lets hope the next ones are all thick and briming with fluff and nice army choices!

Augie · 1 year ago

So you are saying I should get ready to spend $30.00 then?

And then Mr. Wallet said, "*sob*"

YA TEBYA ULTRAMAR · 1 year ago

I have seen this as well.....spent nearly 2 hours enjoying the book the other day.

*giggity!*

The best deal in the book is Capt. Sicarius (More on him in a minute) and the ability to take a 10 man tac squad and "break" it into 2 5-man combat squads that act and are deployed independently of each other. (that's right, 12 5-man troop units can now be deployed across the field and take those objectives!)

Sicarius is a 200 point bad mother! He gets some very nice gear (including 2+ artificer, if I remember correctly) as well as the ability to declare a single tac squad at the start of the game as having tank hunters, furious charge, scout or infiltrate. He also has the ability, if he is on the board, to allow any unit anywhere on the field to use his Leadership (10) when making checks.

Chappys DID keep the ability to give the unit he is attached to a re-roll on misses on the charge though they no longer call it 'litanies of hate'.

Apothecaries can be taken with an honor guard squad and give the unit within (I think it's 5" but I could be wrong) Feel no Pain. That's right bitches, you'll get your 3+ AND a 4+ FNP roll !!

Conversion Beamers are indeed back on techmarines and master of the forge.

AND GW apparently wants you to buy that Masters of the Chapter boxed set as those are the figs they highlight as chapter masters / captains.

(Also, the summary page in the back of the codex is RIDICULOUS!!! SO much goodness you'll need a magnifying glass!!!)

smurfhater · 1 year ago

don't forget Sicarius has feel no pain :)

Grahg_the_Elfmuncher · 1 year ago

No he hasn't. You're confusing it with chaplain Cassius, who has FnP as well as T6.

Blue Byte · 1 year ago

Lets all play SM, not enough around anyway !

YA TEBYA ULTRAMAR · 1 year ago

Enjoy your sour grapes, I am sure they taste great.....

I have been an Smurf since I started playing and am happy to have the latest and greatest.

YA TEBYA ULTRAMAR · 1 year ago

Oh and by the by.....Rhinos now come with the Repair ability....it's very nice...great success!!

Son of Dorn · 1 year ago

They have that now.

smurfhater · 1 year ago

you obviously live nowhere near me theres about three marine players for every other player arond.

Forhekset · 1 year ago

Twin-linked assault cannon, owwie :D

A-Non-Y-Mous · 1 year ago

So far it sounds like a steaming pile to me. Who gives a crap how thick the book is if the rules are boring/terrible. Proxied characters, combat squad marines that cost more than Chaos Marines but have less for the points, and all this other crap doesn't impress me one bit. In the end they're still just 16 point models with crappy rapid fire weapons that die 1/3 of the time they're wounded. Great.

Catzilla · 1 year ago

Crappy rapid fire weapons? Ever played IG?

Dragonlv8 · 1 year ago

I disagree with you in every way imaginable.

Darkseer · 1 year ago

*looks at Dark Angels*
*Cries* :(

Excal · 1 year ago

wonder when/if they'll update the independent SM codexes...

Space Machines · 1 year ago

Well they didn't update the last SM codex when the DA got all the fun stuff, so don't hold your breath. And why should they? DA get Termie command squads, Termies and Bikes as scoring units and the whole fearless thing.

Nero · 1 year ago

Goodbye C:CSM, I hardly knew ye (which is a blessing really, because you were terrible).

Phill · 1 year ago

for the razorback is there a twin plas, one las combo? has it returned?

cookiecuttermarine · 1 year ago

Yes it is back

MeanAngel · 1 year ago

....which is pretty LAME, as Imperial Armour 2 states this to be a RARE (!!!) pattern - and now all of a sudden all codex chapters discovered they had many of them stashed away somewhere... omg ...

And that asscannon/multimelta/h.flamer Razorbacks are pretty much the same B.S. - apart from taking the SoB Immolator its uniqueness, doesn't it seem to you that, every time a Techpriest of Mars goes to a toilet to take a dump these days, he founds an undiscovered STC on the floor ?!?!

</rant>

Khornatedemon · 1 year ago

If you go back to the 3rd ed marine codex it was a standard razorback option. They just brought it back

albertsevil · 1 year ago

CAN NOT WAIT!!
As a long term Death Guard player, i'm looking forward to the chance of some tougher marine armies to battle. And am starting a new SM army with the Black Reach set (that i'm getting in an hour!!).
Been discussing the wargear differences in my local GW and the unanimous house-rule seems that DA/BA/BT will be able to use 'smurf rules for weapons etc.
I think the only real problems are going to be tournaments or power gamers.
New codex sounsds beautiful, and new SM will now be closer to the fluff - love it.

nurglespuss · 1 year ago

To be honest, thats a stupid house rule. The whole premise is that the dark angels, black templars, and to a lesser extent blood angels, all have their own unique strengths/abilities (that help characterise them as such) and don't 'need' the new equipment etc. That stuff is for generic space marines, its their reward for being 'normal'. I swear, if I hear one more DA or BA player moan, my legs will fall off.

Eddie · 1 year ago

I agree they don't get the new weapons options, but the stats for things like ass. cannons and storm shields should be the same.

On a side note, did anyone notice that inquisition still has an ass. cannon at heavy 3/not rending in the 5th edition rulebook?

Me · 1 year ago

And it's stupid cheap because of it.

Docrailgun · 1 year ago

Wow, lots of cool toys...
...but I think I'll stick with my BA Codex.

nurglespuss · 1 year ago

Thats the correct attitude! well done, first bloke.

Nero · 1 year ago

And by 'correct attitude' you mean 'your attitude'? There's nothing wrong with using the SM codex for BA if the SM codex is more fun to play with (which it is, IMO). Get your head out your arse.

Mrrshann618 · 1 year ago

No problem you using the smurf codex if you drop all your BA goodeness. They will eventually put the wargear in line, BA is a online codex anyway, they are going to put out a real one soon. Points are designed with that wargear in mind, you upgrade all the wargear and now you have "cheeper" marines than intended.

Zaeon · 1 year ago

oh man I hope they don't make a real BA codex soon, the amount of marine love GW gives the boys in power armor is silly.

Strykin · 1 year ago

Well, it is their primary army. They have to give all the love to SM because that's the race everyone identifies 40K with .

uroncrack · 1 year ago

you are on crack if you think they are bringing the rest of teh DA/BA in line w C:SM.

nurglespuss · 1 year ago

Seriously? LOL. Theres nothing wrong with using the SM codex INSTEAD of the BA codex, or the BA codex instead of the SM codex for your BA army. Reread, the BA or DA etc. don't need the space marine 'toys' (i.e. codex) they have their own cool stuff/rules/characters etc. To be honest I think think I hear a fiddle playing....

davethepaveway · 1 year ago

1 think i really want to know is - is sicarius I5 or I4 as all previous data said I4 which i saw as stupid

cookiecuttermarine · 1 year ago

This is my first real post to this site. I have seen the new codex and yes it is big and thick and beautiful. I have also seen that the binding on the advance copy that my local store got is horrible and broke in the first day that they got it. Now this could be from all of the local zealots who don't know how to treat things that are not theirs with respect and care. There are tons of goodies with the smurfdex. I play a custom chapter so I use their rules and there is a lot of nice stuff in there. My tactical squads dropped in cost for the more standard configuration of flamers, missile launchers, heavy bolters, and multi-meltas are free. Lascannons are 10 points and plasma cannons are 5 points. Assault Squads imho have lost some of thier luster for tank busting which is what I used them for, in that they can no longer all take meltabombs. Also plasma pistols for Assault squads are 15 points each and are 1 per 5 marines in the squad. My personal favorite is how dreadnoughts have changed in the new smurfdex. Venerable Dreadnoughts are no longer a 0-1 choice and have BS & WS 5 now but cost a sizable amount more. I believe 165 pts with no upgrades. Regular Dreadnoughts stayed at 105 points to start but the base main gun is now the multi-melta and assault cannons cost you 10 points. Ironclads rule, I love you so.

On the concept of using the named characters for other chapters besides whatever normal chapter they are part of the fluff I say, poor form poor form in deed. They are supposed to be legendary characters of renowned to their chapter and that chapter alone. If you want to use them play that chapter, if you don't use the generic marine captain and chapter master rules they are strong in their right.

Techmarines can have drop pods if they are attached to a thunderfire cannon from the heavy support choice.

Bikes can be scoring units in the new smurfdex if the captain is on a bike.

Command squads are now only 5 man units and automatically include an apothecary. You still have to purchase a standard and champion for the unit. They can not take any heavy weapons in the unit.

Honor guard are sick. 115pts for a 3 man unit with the option to increase it to 10 a ten man unit for an additional 35 points per model.

The reason to play BA/DA/SW/BT is not because you like the toys solely or because you can exploit the list in more and many unique ways. You should because the back story is cool and the fluff has drawn you in to feel as part a first founding chapter. As for why they don't get the new toys it is easy there are thousands upon thousands of worlds in the Imperium, and space marine chapters get their gear from hundreds or thousands of different forge and manufactum worlds throughout the Imperium so things are going to vary throughout the Imperium. Not everything is the same. Forgeworlds are secretive, as is the mechanicus so why would all things be made equal. The fluff doesn't, it is GamesWorkshops world let them build it and create the parameters for us to work within.

If you are so sore then build a list that will beat my new smurfdex list or convert to the vast legions of smurfs or custom chapters but stop pouting that you can't have your cake and my cake too.

I do have one question from the new codex. For the Legion of the Damned their profile has them with a 3+ save and then they have a special rule I believe that it is called Undying Spirit that says that it is treated as an Invulnerable save as the basic jist of the rule. Do they have just a 3+ Invulnerable save or do they have a 3+ Armour Save and a 3+ Invulnerable Save?

TheInnerGeek · 1 year ago

I have to respectfully disagree with you on one point. The special characters being portable to other chapters. I think the idea is that the rules for that character are usable by any chapter. Yes, the Ultras might have a great scout sergeant, but other chapters might also have a great scout sergeant too. Personally, I think what they should have done is billed the special characters as generic and nameless, then used examples referencing famous marines from different chapters. So you might have generic super special scout sergeant and in the description state examples of great sergeants from different chapters that this could represent. Just my two cents.

YA TEBYA ULTRAMAR · 1 year ago

You only ever get one save, so it is a 3+ invul. save. The only time you get more than one die roll to avoid death is when you also have Feel No Pain

Eddie · 1 year ago

yes, but some weapons, like psycannons ignore all invulnerable saves, so it does matter in some instances.

-eddie

uroncrack · 1 year ago

don't tell me what I should play and why I should play it.
GW should have the same rules for the same items across the board.

ar_mondo · 1 year ago

the codex at my local stor fell apart too. so there could be a problem withit

Binky · 1 year ago

OK now I finally feel bad for BA players, and that Razorback with twin AC's is the cause.

Sorry to hear that your Baal Preds are no longer relevant.

Docrailgun · 1 year ago

Well, the Baal can still (most of the time) go 6" and fire all its weapons, or 12" and fire its autocannon... or best of all Ram at 18" and do a possible S 10 hit that way. 2 more points of AV helps as well.

Santa · 1 year ago

I can't wait for my Tau to wipe the floor with these new smurfs. The might even give me a challenge... doubt it though.

ZamOne · 1 year ago

Jump shoot jump, I'm teh best general!

pfft, keep on talking, weaboo.

Santa · 1 year ago

My 100 kroot outflank would have you pissing in your power armour

uroncrack · 1 year ago

lmfao. kroot.

ZamOne · 1 year ago

then the marauder bombers come in and blast you stupid kroot to shit, I can theorycraft apoc situations too, weaboo.

Muskie · 1 year ago

You guys are hillarious. I always say lets see it painted, especially to a deadline. We stopped allowing proxy models when 2nd Edition came out, too many stupid army builds.

Also if you play more challenging missions rather than just pile all your figs on the table and blast, that eliminates a lot of gimick lists and generals who rely on unbalanced lists for their competitive advantage.

I can flank march 45 chosen, with lets say 15 plasma guns, and cause it's me they'd all be toughness five...

Santa · 1 year ago

100 kroot is hardly an apocalypse situation. 5 units of 20 for 700 points. Easy, kills against marines.

ZamOne · 1 year ago

then I take 3 vindicators and flamers and missile launchers in my tact squads and flamers for my assault squad. 100 fried lizard chickens made easy.

the theory crafting can continue till we're blue in the face.

LexingtonNet · 1 year ago

Oh, how I want to see this Codex.

denzark · 1 year ago

Do I play people that say I want BA/BT/DA etc, but also want codex abilities? And add in Eldrad because he's a harder psyker than that hom mephiston, and add a Warhaound for 500pts in a non-apocalypse game, and also some rail gun armed Dark Eldar Defilers?

No, becuase I play adults who accept the pay off for your black rages and hand to hand ghastliness is you can't have your cake AND eat it...

The points cost is what keeps it fair.

Zweig · 1 year ago

You are missing the point denzark, a space marine cyclonic missile launcher should be a cyclonic missile launcher, should be a cyclonic missile launcher. There should be no gap in the wargear from codex to codex, it is just bad building of wargear.

I could give a hoot about vanguard or sternguard, give me the same wargear as a BA as a Ultraweenie

Straha · 1 year ago

It all sounds good --- really good! Can't wait to try out the Sternguard Veterans. I'm also planning on adding a few scout bikes.

krootman · 1 year ago

IScout bikes with grenade launchers + melta bombs give you a dead tank. Also on top of that you can booby trap a piece of cover. I am so happy I bought a unit of these way back in the day.

Also out flanking rhinos are going to be NASTY! Think about it, your whole army outflanks you move 12 pop smokes....then you get out of the rhinos next turn and charge thats pretty much a 26 inch charge range. I am not sure but I think there is also a character that lets you reroll reserves as well :D thats going to be a nasty combo..

Lord · 1 year ago

what do grenade launchers do? are they the same as IG ones?

Jackwraith · 1 year ago

Ahem. It's "If only you could see what I've seen with your eyes." ;)

Razarael · 1 year ago

That is a Roy Batty quote, but earlier in the movie, in the freezer. "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe." is at the very end when he's talking to Deckard. Roy and his C-Beams.

Zaarin7 · 1 year ago

All us BA/BT/DA/GN players are asking is in the name of sanity and to avoid confusion ALL THE WARGEAR SHOULD BE THE SAME!!!!!!!.

I DON'T WANT THE NEW TOYS!

I DON'T WANT THE NEW SC.

I DON'T WANT THE NEW SQUAD RULES!

BUT A LR, LRC, LRR, DP SHOULD BE THE SAME I DON'T WHAT COLOR IT IS PAINTED!!!!!

An M1911A1 will put a .45 hole in something I don't care if it is pink, purple, black, blue, yellow, green or red and white polkadot! (Mines military flat black BTW.) The same principle applies to shared wargear!

Hows this for a responce. Since my BT codex is still 4th ed I'll play according to 4th ed. Would anyone want to play a game under those conditions? NO! Having the gear not be rationalised makes about as much sense!

Zweig · 1 year ago

Amen brother, Amen

nurglespuss · 1 year ago

'An M1911A1 will put a .45 hole in something I don't care if it is pink, purple, black, blue, yellow, green or red and white polkadot'

hmmmm I think you've said something important there. WHat if they aren't all the same? What if the stuff used by the BA/BT/DA is more ancient as they are an older chapter? WHat if the newer chapters shields produce a stronger protective field, but only for a short time, whereas the older generation ones run ad-infinitum but at a lower setting?

With so many planets churning out things, and the decrepit, religion based technology replication, then perhaps this variation is quite, quite valid. If I gave 5 different countries weaponsmiths the pattern for an M1911A1, they may produce something that looks the same, but depending on skill and materials, and experience, the effects will be variable....

Zweig · 1 year ago

That is the most ridiculous comment I have ever heard in my entire life. Wargear should equal wargear should equal wargear. And going by your line of reasoning all of the other first founding chapters should equip everyone with powerweapons since they are ancient and have had the time to produce more than their share of them.

Streamline wargear, dont make green colored marine cyclone missile launcher different than red colored marine cyclone launcher

NeilBrimelow · 1 year ago

I can understand having SLIGHT variations on wargear between the different chapters, but a Storm Shield having a 3+ save only for Plain Jane Smurfs, but not Dark Angels, Space Wolves, etc, is just silly.

Same thing goes for the Cyclone Missile Launcher. Why would the Ultramarines have a version that fire DOUBLE the rate of the Cyclone available to the other non-codex adhering chapters? Don't you think that the other chapter's techmarines would get jealous and implement their own "double firing" Cyclone? :)

Anon. · 1 year ago

IT'S NOT TO REFLECT REAL-LIFE IT'S BECAUSE OF THE POINTS!!!

The old BA and DA codexes were written before the re-vamp to the wargear rules. Consequently, there is a rules discrepancy and consequently a points discrepancy too.

40K is ultimately a game, not a simulation, and must be balanced to ensure fairness (even if the balance doesn't quite work - and it never does - to complain is to fall into the "Perfect Solution" fallacy.)

Now wargear DOES equal wargear does equal wargear... but not all Marines are equal. The BA and DA and the rest of the non-codex chapters have marines with radically different rules to regular marines. Therefore, their wargear requires a different points cost.

However, they only release one codex at a time; the non-conformist chapters are "special", and must wait for one of their own. Given the nature of business, it makes more sense to work on other stuff than re-jigging recently released codexes (SW, Necrons, DE, take your pick of Stuff That's Had Less Love Than Your Esoteric Chapter).

So wait. Eventually, they will re-release rules that bring your chapters into line with the current SM codex, with adjusted points. Until then, keep the perspective that It's Just A Game.

If you want more consistency within rules then you really have three options: 1.) do your own rules 2.) wait 3.) moan.

One of those options gives you instant results, one might not work, and one leads nowhere. Take your pick.

NeilBrimelow · 1 year ago

Games Workshop ain't in the financial position to piss off their most valued user base, the Space Marine players.

There is no logical reason why a thunder hammer and storm shield combo should offer different protections for each chapter.

In second edition, the storm shield was needed to protect the wielder of the thunder hammer from the recoil/explosion; essentially from being KNOCKED DOWN from the thunderous blast from the hammer impact.

In later editions, the storm shield's importance was downplayed significantly.

I have no problem with certain codex chapters having slightly tweaked weaponry (specialized weaponry for each chapter), but it's incredibly stupid to come up with ANY reason why the DEATHWING would not have 3+ saves for their storm shields, but Ultramarines would.

What is the point of being able to run a whole army of terminators via Deathwing or Wolf Guard, if they are outmatched by the weaponry of the standard, plain jane terminators?

Anonymous · 1 year ago

Because the Dark Angels codex came out first, and was points costed for the rules as they stood. No other reason than that.

The new SM codex is points costed for the new rules; the old DA one isn't.

Why is that so hard to understand?

People keep saying "It doesn't make sense; there's no reason!" wehn it does make sense, and there IS a reason, it's just a real-world "This is a game played with little bits of plastic" reason, rather than a "well, if we assume one rule for one it MUST apply to all other things!"

No it musn't! Each army is points-costed differently. A DA with Fearless will benefit MUCH more from a Storm Shield with 3+ unmodifiable save than a bog standard Marine without Fearless.

However, the DA will pay the same price in points?! COME ON!!! This is about balance. You'll see new codices with these new rules applied to the fruity chapters. Just in a while...

VonKoeder · 1 year ago

Dark angels had the short end of the stick for how long before anyway? Being the first chapter really blows... wait... Game developers upsetting there customer base blows because then they get in financial problems and we all don't get new toys any more when they go under. For the sake of the game, make the war gear the same. Don't tread on me.

uroncrack · 1 year ago

Hi, Im a FAQ, have we met?

Its the fucking digital age, write a faq and put it on the website.

Eddie · 1 year ago

the terminators stayed the same amount of points, and get better storm shields from 4th to 5th.

by your logic. the cost of single terminators would need to go up to compensate for the increased storm shield cost. Land Raiders are also the same points, but have a larger transport capacity.

Telling others to wait 5 years to receive new stuff you just got is wrong, the same weapon should have the same stats

-eddie

NemoHac · 1 year ago

If that's too ridiculous the I suggest you look into the history of the SMLE and the various nations it was manufatured in... Including the 7.62 variant that India produced for a while.

The same named equipment is often different between original and licensed manufaturers. The world of W40K is much the same in background fluff.

faultie · 1 year ago

This concept/explanation holds so little water as to be ridiculous. If the Space Marines can't have uniform gear (there's only 1000 chapters), how could one ever expect the Imperial Guard to have standardized equipment (there's millions of Guard units!)

And yet, they do have standardized gear in the codex. A lasgun is a lasgun, and a Leman Russ is the same, and its heavy stubber shoots the same distance and its battlecannon is always an ordnance weapon, 5" blast at BS3 (baring AC lists and variants). Ryza, Mars, Gryphonne IV; Valhallen, Cadian, Tallarn; it doesn't matter. The differences aren't represented on the table-top.

As an aside, the whole "some chapters are older" is ridiculous. Salamanders and Ultramarines are to be played from the new Marine Codex, BT have another Codex. Who is First Founding and who is a successor chapter? Think hard.

Not that I care, as I won't be playing Marines. I do, however, support the idea that if a Landraider can move and fire at full BS, all of them should, especially Grey Knights Landraiders. If a vehicle or piece of wargear is called the something, it should operate as everything else called that same thing does. Otherwise, call it something else.

Bob the Unseen · 1 year ago

Ah Faultie, there is precedent for what he's saying. Dan Abbnett made a whole book out of it for Gaunt's Ghosts. They need mark 3 clips and all they had was mark 5 or the like, from the first omnibus. It's something that isn't mentioned a lot in fluff, but it's there.

But the whole argument is to miss the point, there may or may not be an update. I've been told Phil Kelly is often wrong about things. Even if there isn't not all of us have seen the point costs and done the math. Terminators may not cost more but you can't get all the spiffy weapons in only a 5 man squad, I believe DA can. (Please correct me if I'm wrong on that.) If a saw right Storm Shields went up in cost or larger squad sizes were required to use. I don't remember all of it, since I had exactly one minute to read it at my local GW.

BTW Did your chaplain get nerfed to 4BS 2A and 2W? People are bitching about standardization, why are our chaplains wussy and others not?

faultie · 1 year ago

So, Tallarn get more shots than Tanith? Oh. It's the same. Irrelevant point then, as we are not talking about Abbnett's books, but a Codex for the table-top.

Btw, My Chaplain? I'm afraid I don't play an army with Chaplains. Irrelevant point. Without a "dog in the fight", so to speak, I feel I can be a bit more objective in my opinion. I don't really care which of the Marines are cooler/better/faster/have-more-RAM. I just think it a bit off to have multiple things called the same, but functioning differently.

Imagine it wasn't the Stormshield, or the Cyclone launcher. What if it were something more ubiquitous, like the Bolter. What if everyone else's bolters were normal, but in the new C:SM, they were 24" Assault 2. Would every other army with bolters listed as Rapid Fire be upset? Yes. It would be the same situation. The only difference is we're talking about other pieces of wargear, but the premise is the same.

shadow puppet · 1 year ago

You also have to consider the imperium of man does not change their technology at all. So your argument does not make any sense following the fluff. Although i do not think that the independent codexes should get the new "toys" because the codexes are not meant to have them.

GuyLeDouche · 1 year ago

How about the DA can't use their SS against ranged attacks because there is a defect in their gene seed that prevents them from lifting their arms above their waists unless the enemy is in melee range? You are coming up with lame reasons to cover up a poor decision by GW. I could come up with stupid fluff to explain anything, but it still doesn't justify it.

YA TEBYA ULTRAMAR · 1 year ago

You are a grown man playing with plastic toy soldiers....don't be such a souche as to try to bring common sense or reality into this..

Dajanitor · 1 year ago

Whats wrong with being a grown man playing with them?
Oh im sorry getting drunk is more mature huh?
But expressing your creativitiy through models, and having more, healthier fun, is oh so immature...

jay cop · 1 year ago

holy moley ! noone thinking SM are becoming overpowered ?

Anonymous · 1 year ago

http://themacabre.dkpsystem.com/gallery.php?id=3

TheInnerGeek · 1 year ago

That's a handy page to have!

Zweig · 1 year ago

Itouch approved! Train reading woo hoo!

Aleph one · 1 year ago

I agree that Wargear should be standardized but they wont, I mean DA have better shotguns (big whoop ii know) but thats because they call them Manstopper Slugs. However if they have the same name for the wargear is the same!

That being said i really Hope that GW has some guy who is smart enough to see all of these unhappy Marines and be like (we cant fuck over our customer base) lets FAQ all of these Codecies

thats my to cents

eLCee · 1 year ago

why should they have done this back then. Most stuff had remaind the same or lost flexibility.

DA/BA pay more for most units at the end. (regarding free equipment and better items). And Bikes are scoring units in C:SM aswell, DA have to pick a special character to get them, too; same with termis, but that the only think the C:SM codex did not get.

And in general the answer for an update was: there will be none.

raptor1313 · 1 year ago

Add me to the list of people who play DA/BA and are miffed about the wargear.

New shiny units? Ok, cool, big whoop, whatever. I'm fine with an alternate organization of stuff. I doubt I'd use a Thunderfire Cannon or whatever anyway. I'll take my BA Veteran Assault Squad or my Deathwing. The Razorback options annoy me a tad, but I'll deal. I suspect we'll see more Razorbacks anyway.

Though for all you claiming that "Oh, it's perfectly fair, logical, and balanced" that a Storm Shield is not always a Storm Shield, and in some cases a Storm Shield is really an uber-hoss Iron HAlo...give me a break. Be perfectly honest with yourseves. If I could give my BA Terminators a 2+/3++ statline with a storm shield and a Codex: Space Marines was stuck with a 2+/5+ and a 4++ in melee, would you be saying fair and balanced? If my BA Cyclones were heavy 2 or so, or my guys got free heavy weapons, would you say fair/balanced?* If our machine spirit could fire at BS4 and yours couldn't, what would you say?

I don't really expect GW to FAQ it. Considering that Grey Knights are still stuck with a Heavy 3 assault cannon, no, not really. But let's be honest. Would you like it? No, you wouldn't. Don't go on about how people should just shove it and accept it because it favors you, for now.

But as a BA/DA player, I'm not at all thrilled about it. Standardize the wargear. Please. That's all we ask. It's also going to confuse the crap out of people. "...wait, aren't storm shields a 3++ save all around?"
"...no. Ours are red."



*I'll admit that with the points increase, a 10-man squad has actually paid for its heavy weapon. That says nothing for whether or not a Sarge is included automatically.

**your plasma weapon costs have been brought in line with others, at least.

TheInnerGeek · 1 year ago

It'll be nice to have a nice thick codex. You'll feel like you got your monies worth out of it, plus you can smack your opponent with it when he whines... or takes out your your Stern Guard vets...

Matt Quick · 1 year ago

Wargear updates are definitely in order........

BrianGeneral · 1 year ago

Can I be the one here that will HATE this Codex?

Don't get me wrong, I do play Marines (Custom Chapter in 4th) and I'll be benefitted from these. But in short these stuff aren't pleasing me.
Yeah, Marines shoudl be powerful by fluff, and yeah, their previous performances are pretty subpar......But I didn't expect stuff like these: Nearly unkillable Objective-denying unit that murder most units in CC with the SAME cost as before, those Ravenwing-like Troop units that can homer muder squads that can DS on charge (which even DW/Daemons can't), cheaper-than-Deathwatch Sternguards that can get all 4 types of ammo, PotMS moves from a nice gimmick to an OP ability and overrides the core rules WITHOUT penalty.......Yuck.
Did I mention some of teh new gimmicks for Marines are actually using other armies' speciality, while the being-copied armies aren't having a good boost (I'm looking at you, DA) to compensate that? At the very least, sticking to fluff is one thing, game-balancing is another. "Expect a cost increase"? From the present cost of these units I don't think their point costs justify their abilities.

Still, I'll keep playing 40K even when facing these stuff. But I'm sure that I won't enjoy games that much like before with Marines (which will certainly become more popular), either using or against them.

raptor1313 · 1 year ago

Ok...read the new 'dex.

Blood Angels, beyond fluff, have about three things going for them that are close to distinct:
1) The Death Company
2) Baal Predator
3) 5-man squads that can take a special.
4) Assault Marines as troops

I don't mind that the marines get a lot of cool HQs. Frankly, they kind of needed it.

Nevermind what I said about my Veteran Assault squad. They're not really hot stuff any more.

Furiosos, beyond their ability to get 'Venerable', are better than Ironclads only in that they are a bit cheaper. (125 for Venerable w/ Heavy Flamer vs. 135 base and the 13/13/10 armor).

The VAS is simply outclassed in terms of options.

What do the DA have distinctive?
The Deathwing. The Ravenwing is (as much as it was ever a competitive build, but in the hands of some...) more or less out, as any commander can now take bikes as troops. The RAvenwing are just the fearless, less flexible cousin of that. Anyone wanting to play the DA without making heavy use of the 'Wings had better just forget it, since there's really no advantage.

This'll apply for DA and BA...
The cost cuts on the Razorbacks (hey, for some reason the bog-standard heavy bolter model is cheaper) and standard Dreadnought are still a bitter pill to swallow. The tactical squads don't really bother me. The cost cuts on the Predator and Landspeeder are just plain insulting to us.

The new and improved Power Of the Machine Spirit is another kick in the bollox.

To be perfectly honest, it feels like right now the ONLY warm and fuzzy a BA/DA player gets right now is playing fluffy.

Let me be clear on this. I'm not clamoring to make the BA/DA dexes overpowered. I don't honestly think they ever were. But compared to the new Marine codex, there are scant few competitive reasons to play either of them.

Ben · 1 year ago

As an Eldar player I'm a little miffed about the new librarians. They all come with 2 powers base. Eldar are supposed to be the most powerful psychers in the game, but a farseer has to buy a piece of wargear to use 2 powers. Also Tigurius gets 3 powers, which I believe only Eldrad Ulthran got before. And let's face it, I think Eldrad is a little more powerful of a psycher. Hopefully the limited range on Psychic Hoods is true, and runes of warding should still shut down enemy psychers pretty well.

raptor1313 · 1 year ago

Well, to be honest, the LIbbies aren't that new. They're one of the things brought into line (sort of) with the BA/DA dexes.

Even before this, they could take two powers. However, you will notice that they cannot USE both powers in a turn.

It still takes a hero-level psyker to use multiple powers in a turn. Mephiston is one of them, and Tigurius is the other. In general*, Eldar are still better Psykers.

*unless some of the new powers really are that nasty, but it's hard to deny the sheer utility of Doom/Guide/Fortune.

Republican Marine · 1 year ago

Disagree about Tigurius... He can tap into the very mind of the Tyranid Synapse. Thats pretty lete. There is always that rare (super) human that equals the ability of even the more gifted 'space elves' (see emperor)

paelkeizah · 1 year ago

i met jes godwin today... the creator of the new codex: space marines and got a few things signed and was looking at the codex everything in it's sweet!

smurfhater · 1 year ago

actually he's the creator of space marines in general. not just the new codex.
Oh and i met him yesterday too and also got his signature.

Ds86 · 1 year ago

Why..... why the hatred??? ITS A GAME!

Yes at the moment, wargear is not fair imho....but they had to start it somewhere, either that or release all SM chapters at the same time.

There has to be a start to the change, and your seeing it, and you say there wasnt an advantage for other chapters previously??

as an example BA: drop pods you can fire out of and didnt have to leave
mephisty...free codex....
cheaper attack bikes with multimeltas, the troops are more expensive cause your paying for a death company member, and dont get me started on the vet assault squad and the furioso, we bit our tounge because it wasnt our fluff but were envious,

So you see there are always ups and downs, and at the moment there is alot of ups with the ultras, ive been ultra for 6 years now, first 40k army i started with, and you know the only people i dont hear complaining about this is??

Space wolves...they know their codex will be updated soon, as should you all look forward to getting a new shiny codex which will have all the smurfs have and much more that no doubt we will be envious about

Sarpedon · 1 year ago

wow raptor 1313, this is the internet. i don't know about all those logical points you were making, maybe you need to flame a couple people now, otherwise people might actually get the idea of being kind and reasonable to others! lolz.

As a DA player, I don't want smurf gear. I would like very much for it to be fair, but it is what it is. last night when I spoke with the owner of my local shop, he said there are rumors that DA will be posted in an online series like the BA. : / which i'm personally not a fan of.

Also, Salamanders are now one of the new big 4 chapters, which IMO contradicts previous fluff that they are a fairly small chapter with no anti-grav or jump packs, and lots of flame/heat related weapons. I was looking through pics in the new codex, and they have Salamander assault troops, in direct contradiction with the info in that old book, Index Astartes IV.

malwych · 1 year ago

If you hyphenate the twin-linked in 'twin-linked assault cannon', then technically it's only three words...

Borin · 1 year ago

New librarians are very overpiced, they chose to powers from the list of 9 but could only use 1, a 50pts upgrade it's needed to use 2 in a turn. Also have a very poor statline for a marine the same as the chaplain and it's the same profile than a vet. sargeant with WS5 and W2.
Both the chaplain and librarian base cost it's 100pts and the psi-hood it's nerfed and even without the nerf the uber cheap farseer stones that make roll on 3D6 and add them that's the ones overpowered and extremely underpriced and on top of that wihtout range.

Also tigurius it's 230pts with a patetic statline (same as new librarians) and without inv save. It's a match for the 3 big ones in the psiquic powers as Eldrad, Ahriman and Mephiston could all use 3 powers a turn and know all the powers from it's respective races.

Brother_Marius · 1 year ago

Frankly, 16pts buys me what used to cost me 18 (grenades for all marines) AND a bolt pistol I didn't have... so now when I'm about to charge you I can sling my bolter, whip out the pistol and SHOOT YOU IN THE FACE before I charge you... goodness all around. Great way to possibly thin out a large enemy unit before a charge, but bad idea if you kill too many and wipe the squad that turn.. shoot em lightly... yeah that's it...
But... those 16 pts also gets me free specials/heavies... so I STILL end up a bit cheaper than I used to for a standard tac squad. Vet sgts would be the only worry... are they 31 or 32pts before wargear upgrades.

Zweig · 1 year ago

which they were before if you paid for TH.

90+80 = 170 to get a squad with a flamer and missile launcher, sgt with BP/CCW. Couple that with combat tactics and some of the other goodies named characters give you, your army will be a lean mean fighting machine.

Mind you as BA i pay 205 for that same squad, but hey I get "free" death company am I right?

Brother_Marius · 1 year ago

Nope, you could go flat vanilla for 150, ten marines w/ no upgrades. TH was extra (15pts) and let you pick wargear.
Now it looks like it's going to be like the BA/DA setup. it's still cheaper in the new dex than it was in the old for the same gear.
But yeah, codex marines end up being able to pack just a few more guys into the list or upgraded elites.

scoutsniper · 1 year ago

Ive read many posts about the new marine dex for some months now, and its obvious the loudest voices against this dex has been from DA/BA/BT. I've been in 40K since the early 90's and I can say that this release of a codex really isn't unlike releases in the past. There are always players angry with whatever changes were made, and continuous discussion (fluff, speculation, whatever...) justifying or demonizing the change. Yes that does include claims this will ultimately hurt GW. Believe it or not.......This has ALL been said many times before over the years.
I'll qualify what I say by admitting I am an Ultramarine hobbiest from the start. It is not my only army (Guard, Chaos Marines). But the reality of "standardization" of wargear between the Marine chapters is that it has never existed (LR crusader, Baal Predator, Space wolves have the leman russ exterminator, Dark angels with cheaper rhino/ better whirlwhind, furioso dreadnought etc). This list goes on. These units are not / were not always, available to all the dex lists for one reason or another (the biggest reason I've heard was fluff===whatever it might be). BUT the reality of this hobby is "change." GW has continuously changed, and advanced the hobby mainly by generating interest in this exact way: new edition of rules and army lists. For all you angry BA/DA/BT and others,.....this will never go away. And there it is..
With that said. Everyone in the hobby has been the beneficiary and the whipping boy at sometime during these changes. For those of you who want to cry foul that you want your land raider to carry just as many troops as someone else's......you have to explain why only blood angels can have furioso-dreadnoughts. You'll argue fluff dicates it. Try explaining why supercharged engines on rhinos aren't standard (why not on a chimera?), and you'll say the same thing. That is not a real justification for it. Those of you in the hobby for a long time know the fluff has always said marine chapters have always had their supplies provided to them by their independent sources, and these sources are arranged by the chapters themselves (agreements from neighboring systems for example). Baal just doens't make a better landraider (I'm just teasing) than others :) (probably not a good enough explanation for you, but true...look it up).
You doomsayers/sky is falling marine players, relax.....you'll look at your lists, and you'll survive. You'll stay in the hobby and you'll feel alright in the next few months. You may cry foul again if you lose a game to the new dex (and you know you're a "gamer" type), but even then you might just decide not to play at worst. GW will make its money and will continue to thrive. In a couple of years you'll have your new codex BA/BT/DA, and your complaints will fall silent ..again (hypocracy). You're still special. $GW$ still loves you too.


Space Wolves...ignore the above..you guys should be writing your state congressperson for a new codex at this point :).

For you vanilla/ultramarines.....don't EVEN try to justify the new codex....just enjoy it while it lasts :).

For the 40k'ers in general, congrats on another good looking codex. I can't wait to see what the new Dark Eldar/ TAU/ Guard codex will be like if this is an indicator of the new direction GW is going in.

I not trying to offend anyone with this post. If i have I sincerely apologize.
I just thought we could use a little straight-talk on the matter.

keep the dice rollin'
Scout Sniper

Zweig · 1 year ago

The "sane" BA/DA players could give a hoot about cheaper rhinos/pods or OCE on rhino's. That is what we pay for the "upgrade", and understand that. However when power of the machine spirit is different from chapter to chapter, and storm shields are different from chapter to chapter, then you have some big issues...

Sarpedon · 1 year ago

I'm glad someone else agrees with me. Sure, as a DA player I'll whine a bit when i lose to some smurfs,but I love this too much to stop. fer reals. we're all in this game together.

RTM · 1 year ago

Can I ask a technical (i.e. possibly FAQ'able) question here?

As an omnissiah-o-phile, I'm concerned about the text regarding servitors. Units of servitors cost 10 points for one, but then +15 points per model after the first? Is that a typo, so that servitors are really 10 points for one then 10 points per model to add more? It seems, well, EXTREMELY odd.

It's also clear that servitors can be bought as an extra unit if you get a thunderfire, since the thunderfire clearly comes with a techmarine, but it's not clear if that unit of servitors can augment the techmarine in the artillery unit. Odd as well, yes?

RTM

Tacobake · 1 year ago

The new Space Marine codex makes me feel like a man.

Hurr!

Mad_Max · 1 year ago

SWEET!!!

Admiral Drax · 1 year ago

Re. Cyclone missile launchers)

Haven't the time to read all the above, but it's interesting to note that in the latest UK White Dork (the one with free terminator and ork) they had a useful little tip for converting the free terminator into a cyclone termi using leftover cyclone bitz from the terminator sprue.

Mind you, it's nothing on the 12" blast template or catastrophic launch cyclone options from 2nd edition!

- Drax

Bigred · 1 year ago

Guys, please do NOT post download links to copies of the codex.

Aleph one · 1 year ago

Technically guys

Space Marines are still 15 points, but adding extras (dunno why) is +16 ea.

cause u get 4 marines and a Vet
(15x5) + (15 terminator honours)

SoR · 1 year ago

Amen Scout Sniper, the truth and reality of the situation!

BTW, the new codex Cyclone missile launchers are not Heavy 2,
they are still Heavy 1.

Except now they fire a Cyclonic Torpedo.

"Shooting the Cyclonic Torpedo now...."

*rolls to hit*

"I, WIN."

;p

-Sons of Russ

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

it is heavy 2 as both frag and krak....

cyclonic torpedo is the *IWIN* button in each new marine list

Anon The Bus · 1 year ago

How does the Lascannon-TL Plasmagun turret on the Razorback work? Are they considered separate weapons and both can only be fire if it's stationary (due to STR) or do they fire together as one weapon? How did it work in previous editions

New codex is WIN! Twin linked powerfists and servoharness on a bike hoo rah!

denzark · 1 year ago

Not all equipment is the same. The effect from a M1911 is going to differ with different ammo, so that exampe doesn't follow. By the fluff, in M31, all marines pre-heresy were pretty standard in equipment. Cut forward 10000 years, and imps have ATSKNF, CSM don't even though closely related. So why shouldn't The various angels have some items of kit that doesn't work to spec? Maybe their STC is flawed like their geneseed. There's amillion reasons that would be in line with the fluff, and it's also game balance.

Anon · 1 year ago

What i think is a fault in the wargear and ties in with the fluff, is that all these people saying 'oh BA/DA/SW/BT are first founding chapters(BT not included) their wargeard is older', without sounding to American 'HELLO!' Where the fug are the Ultramarines from? "1st founding, i think not! They have from my last check about 4 major Forge Worlds in the Eastern fridge, why on earth is their gear better all of a sudden than their other brother first founding chapters? I think this codex should have been, in some respects like 4th edition, i that the Chapter Traits where mainly to make your own chapters. This codex should operate on that same basis.

When will it be CODEX: Ultramarines, and not CODEX Space Marines, because its quite clear to everyone that The Smerfs arnt the begining and end for the Space Marines, christ Roboute didnt even anywhere close to the victories of Johnson, Russ, Lupercall.

Borin · 1 year ago

That some hate Ultramarines for being the model of the great majority of chapter (fluff wise true) and being the representatives of the standard marine dex for 2 editions has nothing to with changing fluff.
Also I've played Ultramarines since 2n edition and they only get some love at the 4th edition; before Space Wolfes, Blood Angels and Dark Angels get much more love than the utlramarines.

The ultramarines legion was the one that brought more planets to the light of the emperor in the great cruseade (and left the planets better equiped and aoutomous). Ultramarines itselfs almost conquered the whole ultima segmentum (the bigger one).

Rules wise will be a bad decision upgrade some of the wargear of the other chapters specially in things like storm shields on terminators scoring units (dark angels). Some other wargear wouldn't be a problem but GW would not take the time to recost these codex to adapt the wargear and cost until it releases a v2 or a newer one.
And of course most of those chapters only want the good things but will moan if it's hood it's also "upgraded" to new SM standard.

Andy · 1 year ago

Damn, you are an idiot.

Have you read all the posts here from DA/BA players?

WE DON'T WANT YOUR SHINY NEW TOYs, OK?

Here, I'll repeat that since you're retarded.

WE DON'T WANT YOUR SHINY NEW TOYS!

Why is it a bad decision to give us the same wargear? We we still pay more in the long run after the list is made. A CML is a CML is a CML, no matter if its painted Ultra-smurfs blue or Dark Angels Green.

Really, it is NOT too much to ask to get the same wargear.

And what idiot would take a DW army of all Storm Shields? The best way to take down Termies these days is with high rate of fire weapons, we won't get to use the 3+ save. Not to mention they will never shoot at you because they have NO GUNS, and will always GO LAST in CC. That army will lose.

But before I go, let me repeat the key point of my post.

WE DON'T WANT YOUR SHINY NEW TOYS!

rubics · 1 year ago

Holding the entire Imperium together after an all-out civil war was no thang. :P

JustFacePalm · 1 year ago

Ummm... Robute held the entirity of the Imperium together long after Russ and Captain Emo wandered off. Hate to break it to you... but four.. count em FOUR chapters do not make up the majority of chapters. Da/BA/Wolves and Templars are not by any stretch, even with successor chapters, the majority. Learn to count. The ultra's have 20 successor chapters... that's more than all 4 and their kiddies. Hell the Templars are a successor chapter themselves... from a CODEX chapter.
Ummm Lupercall? and what chapter are they again?? Oh yeah... that's the warcry of a traitor legion from a crappy novel series... I'm sure the Black Legion likes the plug, but you need to go back to reading

Great Unclean One · 1 year ago

first off... the Horus Heresy BL books are some of the best books for the hobby, so don't be bitchin abt it....
second... so all you ppl dont want the shiny new toys,... i think you should get some of them.... i also blv that the wargear shud be standardized....
im a C:SM player and I will say this... ultramarines ARE the SM studs of the Imperium...

and some ppl say that points cost would radically change if the wargear was standardized.. not in my opinion it wouldnt, considering that the new stuff is costed the same as in existing divergent codexes.

seldius · 1 year ago

to the BA/BT/DA players that constantly whine....you are the reason why SM players are assumed to be immature dooshbags. you guys had the special stuff for so long and now the vanillas get their own wargear and you all get your panties in a tussle.

i totally agree with a previous poster. you want your cake and MY cake too

please tell me where it's written in the rules that all SM chapters and BA/BT/DA must have the exact same wargear. the rules will say that vanilla SM players will have some wargear unigue to them. thats it. accept it and be a man about it you wuss sucking leeches.

i truly believe the BA/DA/BT guys that are whining are most likely 14 year olds who are just little spoiled jackholes that want all the rules to benefit them so they can feel better about themselves. so they can proclaim "I rulez teh table bichez"

i will refuse to play any non codex player who comes to me with the garbage of "hey i want to play using YOUR wargear AND still have the advantages and unique aspects of my BA/BT/DA"

rolls eyes

abinavjain · 1 year ago

chill a little dude...

some of the complaints are justified.... I am a codex marine player myself... and I think when it comes down to the basics, all chapters should have the same wargear... SM/SW/BA/DA/BT should all have storm shields that give 3+ invul save and that all the LRs should be capacity 12 and LRC's capacity 16 and so on...

a lot of the divergent players don't want the new units and special rules and all... they just want a standardization across the board for the same equipment.

FormerMarine · 1 year ago

So according to the new codex, I could take a Land Speeder with 2 heavy flamers??!

Acme2468 · 1 year ago

I got a half hour with my stores preview copy the other night. Dem Beakies is getting themselves some mighty fine loot aright, maybe now they'll be able to give us Orks a Proppa fight!

scoutsniper · 1 year ago

Bravo Anonymous......

This is exactly the reasoning they don't seem to understand. Reading through the threads you can definitely see the "that's not fair" attitude. I think what is lacking among those BA's/ DA's/ whoevers is the perception that this "hobby" does not reflect real-life and certainly never claims to uphold some gamer/ hobbiest's code of justice. It may appear to at times. You could argue the "GW powers that be" are trying to make things fair, but the reality at the end of the day is that this is a business that wants to stay in business. Marines have always been the cash-cow and have always generated the $, and as such you have the new codex.
This is not new. This has happened with EVERY release of a new edition of 40K. 3rd edition's released was flanked by a brand new Blood Angel Codex which GW admitted was overpowered. There was an explosion of new BA armies as a result. Was this wrong? Did it matter?
This is the nature of the hobby that is 40K. Yes it could be better. No it will probably never be fair. Complete balance within this GAME has never been achieved. This is not the first time your crisis has occurred and trust me,...it won't be the last. Welcome to the hobby that is 40K.
Now I know what many will say about my comment. And I do sympathize with those who are annoyed. Everyone that has been the hobby long enough hates it when 40K has to change (even if it mean another army gets boosted or dumbed down). The reality is that the sky is not falling, GW will make it's money, and life goes on.

But for now,.....word from GW is BA/DA/BT codexes are "stand alone" only.
Maybe we should call this codex what it is.....Codex: Ultra/White scars/Raven Guard/salamanders, complete with unique wargear. Would that make everyone feel better?

Ahhh to be 14 years old again....
Scoutsniper

Andy · 1 year ago

"Ahhh to be 14 years old again....
Scoutsniper"

I got news for you buddy, but the vast majority of the 14 year olds are the ones using the vanilla SM codex.

The majority of BA/DA players are those of us who've been playing since Rogue Trader and Space Hulk, because those are the armies we are nostalgic about. None of the kids want to play BA/DA because we get less goodies, so they go to
Codex: ULTRASUPERAWESOMEMARINES so they can be totally super awesome, because if theres one things kids love, its having the most powerful/coolest/hippest thing.

And don't we know it, thats C:SM.

So don't you, or anyone else, insinuate that players of DA and BA are a bunch of 14 year olds, I'd bet my life's savings that the number of kids playing DA and BA are a fraction of those who use C:SM.

And if you are trying that the reason this is happeninig is because its a business move intended to make money, then you clearly have no idea how business works. If this is such a GREAT BUSINESS MOVE, then why the $%&* would GW leave out FOUR CODEXES WORTH OF PLAYERS out in the cold? How could they possibly concieve that making it so almost all of the new releases are totally useless to FOUR CODEXES WORTH OF PLAYERS, is a great business move? Are they trying to alienate thousands of potential customers?

Really, at first, I was happy that C:SM was getting some love, and I bet most DA/BA players were glad too. We just want the same wargear, we're ok with not getting new units. Really, we are.

But then we ask for the same rules and suddenly a large portion of C:SM players are up in arms!

"ZOMG YOU CAN'T HAS THE SAME RULEZ AS ME! YOU AREN'T SPACE MARINE!!!"

Yes, we are. Yes, we *#$%ing are!

We're the Dark Angels, the FIRST %$#@ING LEGION!

We're the Blood Angels, our Primarch fought Horus!

We're the Space Wolves, the sons of Russ, the greatest fighter in history!

And now we're to be told, that little Jimmy's LORDS OF SUPER DEATH KILLING Chapter of Space Marines', gets to use a CML that fires 2 rockets, and the three chapters that have been around since the birth of the Imperium do not? Three of the most successful and best supplied chapters in the Imperium? (And don't even try to argue against that, they've lasted 10,000 years.)

GIVE ME A BREAK.

GW has succeded in alienating a huge chunk of its customers, and some of the players using C:SM have succeded in showing the WH:40k community what greedy little wankers they are.

So please, why don't you go crowd around Codex: Greedy Pieces of Sh_t,
and circle jerk to the wargear, IC, and Army List sections. Don't forget the tissues.

JustFacePalm · 1 year ago

Damn... you really are an idiot... go make a damned house rule and stop crying like a two year old.. the GW teat does not rule all...
Pull your head out of your ass and go dry your tears. Quit making bullshit, braindead statements backed by air that smells of whiney bitch.
You need a faq to use common sense? If the new codex makes you quit the friggin game, I say good. One less whiney crybaby that can't think on their own.
EVERY single 40k rulebook since Rogue Trader tells you to use WHAT YOU WANT from the book, house rule shit you want changed and get on with the game. I can't think of any reasonable opponent that will tell you Dark Angels have fatter asses than Ultramarines.
'A vast majority..." going by your posts, you're one of the 12 year olds I see with crayola colored Baal Predators. Get a grip, get over it, and stop crying, noone cares. Go play emo marines in the basement and tell yourself it'll be alright

denzark · 1 year ago

Actually I've been playing Ultramarines since I got WD 126 (UK) and it had descriptions of the chapters in an article about epic. Whilst SPace Wolf were top dog for assault, and BA were drop troops, it said UM had a larger proportion of Techmarines and thus heavier fire power. So for their kit to work better is a long established fluff principle. Even though at that age I didn't understand the first army list in the compendium made everyone equal.

Most of you won't understand the documents to which i refer not having been on the earth that long, and apparently want to win before you reach the table purely on the basis of your list selection. And I stand by my earlier coment, Mephiston is gayer than Dale Winton. Not that that makes him a bad person, just a bit of a wrong'un for a librarian.

HBMC · 1 year ago

"Scout Bike Squads are one the true standouts of the codex. These go from zero to hero."

Of course they do. They're getting a new model kit. And it's not like they could've made Scout Bikers any worse!!!

BYE

BrassScorpion · 1 year ago

Since I'm looking forward to the models and the Space Marine book is a fun read, my ambivalence toward this book because of the less colorful books before it is somewhat mitigated. I've read portions of the book via the sample copy at my Battle Bunker. 40K has always run this cycle since 2nd edition, so in spite of the less than spectacular by comparison Codices before it, hopefully the new SM book is a sign of better things to come for the next few years.

I've helped build a store sample of the Drop Pod and held the Land Raider Redeemer as well. They are exciting models. The other stuff coming looks great too and I'm extremely pleased with Assault On Black Reach and the models withn it. All this great new stuff is too much fun to be too down about comparing the new Codex to the few that came just before it, in spite of the fact that I have both Chaos Marine and Dark Angels armies.

lorddemos · 1 year ago

what about storm shields? Are they really +3inv all around?

Charles · 1 year ago

Space Marines are looking like the spoiled whiney brats of 40k. Waaa!!! they (insert army here) have a neat new toy or ability, I want it too, and I wan't theirs to be ineffective against me!!!! What, can no army out there have something that the SM's don't either duplicate, have a gadget to annull, or both?

Rork · 1 year ago

Given that the price on the basic marine rose modestly at best coupled with drastic decreases in just about everything else, I really doubt we will see a decrease in SM model count.

Also, Thunderhammer/stormshield terminators are 40pts each, just as they are now.

Vanguard vets that can assault from Deep Strike and have an extra attack over Chaos Raptors are the *exact* same price as Chaos Raptors, and have no restrictions on how many can be taken.

The Vindicator is 10pts *CHEAPER* than it is in the DA/CSM books, but also auto-passes terrain tests.

Balance? In this codex? I think not. At least not compared with any of the newer SM books.

Rotaser · 1 year ago

One question to all the "senn with own eyes" out there:
The Master of the Forge offers to take Dreads as Elite and/or Support... any kind of dread or only the "normal" ones?
And yes, of course I could wait, but I want to know if I need 10 or 20 Terminators for my upcoming army (damn, 11 years of gaming, and finally I'm going to play marines.... )

Anonymouse · 1 year ago

Quick/easy questions:
1) Are Vanguard Veterans an ELT or FST choice?
2) Can I no longer have Reclusiam and Librarium Command Squads? That's going to force me to modify my chapter fluff a bit....

So far the rumours are good. I hope some of these new toys will give me a fighting chance against this Tau player I have as my recurring opponent.

Anonymouse · 1 year ago

.... and I guess I'm not getting any answers soon because this seems to be an inter-chapter wargear flame war.

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

sternguard are elites while vanguard are fast attack.....

i did not see options for reclusiam/librarium command squads... but wth... a few conversions here and there... a few minor rules modifications here and there... voila... u got them!

bob · 1 year ago

i'm a BA player and i have to say that this really is looking quite bad for me,
not because of the rules but the loss of the reason behind our army, i recently looked through the codex at my local and couldn't help but feel sad.
As a Blood Angel player we got certain things to go with our fluff and it was cool un til now.
what did we have:
1) Honour Guards
2) Furioso dreadnaughts
3) Death company
4) Veteran Assault Squads
5) Assault Squads as troops
6) Overcharged Baals
8) Overcharged rhinos
all good stuff but now but now
C:SM has honour guards as well as command squads with relic blades, alot better
you can now have furioso dreadnaughts as well as ironclad dreadnaughts
we still have death company which is cool, not so great anymore but still a beast so cool
well, you have veteran assault squads that are fast attack options so don't even take up valuable elite slots
your assault squads are insanely cheap now, an assualt orientated chapter with assult squads that are far more expensive
baal predators but when you can field 2 baal razorbacks for the same points which can also carry troops, somethings gone wrong
we have overcharged rhinos for 10 more points which i guess is fair but still harsh, its fluff though so i'm happy to keep it.
what i'm trying to point out is that it feels like the bloodangels have lost there heart and fluff, the whole set up of the army to fit in with the fluff is now better seen in the standard codex and i think thats why people are getting up set
space marines should get new stuff and new rule, but did they have to steal nearly everything that made BA BA and DA DA

just_chris · 1 year ago

Yeah, I got a look at this the other day and it's pretty awesome. I was personally very pleased to see that Techmarines have a bike as an option for transport - I just finished a conversion job and although there's probably better ways to spend an Elites slot, it looks freakin' cool and I'm looking forward to trying him out on the field. I'm a bit disappointed that Dark Angels get 'em for free (in terms of force org slots) and we 'nilla 'rines don't. :( Nah it's all good, we've got some goodies (fucken scout bikes FTW!).

Sayles78 · 1 year ago

Just looked at the new Codex. Only had 2 mins with it cos there was a bunch of screaming kids wanting it.

Sicarius is WS6 BS5 S4 T4 I5 W3 A4 LD10 200 Points.

Has a power sword which he can choose to make 1 attack with at S6 causing Instand Death. Also has artificer armour that gives him feel no pain.

If anybody is interested....

Also Shrike is only 195 points and he's a beast!

DustDevil · 1 year ago

As soon as I heard that a new marine codex was coming out, I decided to start collecting an army, so I could have it painted and ready by the time the new codex appeared. I was a bit worried that they would turn out to be naff, but from what I've heard so far they sound great.

I normally play Eldar against a Tyranid opponent, so I am already very used to being outnumbered and paying a high price for individual units. Infact my only concern now is that the new marines are going to end up a bit too much like my Eldar, with small units specifically tailored to certain roles on the battlefield, but I suppose that depends on how I configure the army more than anything. I have a reall soft spot for basic infantry (hence my Eldar are painted as Ulthwe, and contain lots of guardians), so I expect most of my marine army will be made of infantry.

The new Ironclad dreadnought in particular sounds great. Does anyone know if there is going to be a new model released for it ? or whether it will be left for conversion opportunity instead.

I read in an earlier post that someone saw that the multimelta is now the new standard Dreadnought armament, and you have to pay extra points to get an Assault cannon. I hope that is not true. I read in WD that the basic GW dreadnought kit doesn't come with a multi-melta, which is why they wanted to have one in the AoBR kit (I haven't bought a dread yet so I don't know if this is correct). If this is true, I wonder if GW will change the dreadnought kit ? It seems a bit bizarre that the only weapon missing in the standard dread box is the default army list weapon.

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

not to sound like a complainer/whiner or anything but some options in the new codex don't make sense... to me at least....

- Chaplains can no longer have lightning claws at all O.O
- Chaplains can no longer have jump-packs O.O (not sure about this one though)
- Terminators and Command Squads can no longer take veteran skills like Furious Charge, Tank Hunters, Infiltrate
- In a command squad, any veteran can take special weapons like flamers, meltaguns, or storm bolters and what not....
- A full squad of Assault Marines with no upgrades costs a dirt cheap 190 points O.O WTFH????????
- since when in the name of the Emperor did SM take digital weapons, which have always been a province of Inquisitors, considering most digital weapons are xeno archaeotech originally.

like seriously, some of the cries of marines being broken seem to be justified (I am a Space Marine player with 10k points) while some of the better options from the list have been taken out.... i'm miffed most about my chaplain no longer having lightning claws...

who the hell wrote this codex??? some of the options just plain don't make sense even from fluff pov.... i've never read of a command squad toting 5 meltaguns or storm bolters or wtv.....

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

...*slightly awestruck*....
I might cry now, didn't know any of this.
Im just glad i managed to get the codex ordered! WOOOOOOOT!!!!
Cheap assault marines are awsome, but im not sure its too good for us Tau players!

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

Can i ask about the troops choices, what is there?
And apparently the commander has lots of options, can someone name a few great ones?
Thanks Guys.

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

digital weapons?
he comes with a bolter and bolt pistol?
all the standard stuff...
of and one important thing: NO MORE TERMINATOR HONOURS AND PURITY SEALS... BYE BYE +1 Attack!!!

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

thanks

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

tactical squads and scouts are there as normal... although scouts can take a special ammo... and sniper rifles are now free upgrades...

Lord · 1 year ago

I just wanted to make a few comments.

First, I am sure GW has multiple good reasons for making stuff different in different codexs. they will have playtested them many times, and are sure that it is not that unfair, it is just different.

Second, if a BA/DA/SW/BT player is that annoyed, why doesn't he/she just play that army using the regular SM rules. use the same models, and tough cookies. as no player would do that, then I am not sure why they are complaining, as they are happier with their current list.

finally, I think this codex is great. I only wish GW would show the heresy armies some love. It is a best selling series, and with the exception of this site, there are no rules, even close to official.

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

I myself being a DA player, am going to play DA with the new codex.

Lord · 1 year ago

Then why do you are you bitching about the codex. It is a well needed new book, for GW main money source. If it works for 90% of the marine players, than they should be happy. The other 10% being BA/DA/SW/BT players can continue to play their army. Any regular SM players, it is a good codex, just use it the right way.

Fire_Warrior · 1 year ago

Im not complaining about the codex, read my comments, and i agree with you about the needed book.

Greg · 1 year ago

i have gotten a look at my local stor's copy of the new marine codex. 1 of the nice things they have changed is the tech marine is now able to move to the tank he plans to repaid instead of bein in BtB contact at the beginning of the repair attempt. ie you move to the tank and repair it instead of shooting that turn (the tank can fire a weapon that just got fixed)

Nobody · 1 year ago

twin-linked assault cannon....... yes YES Y-E-S!

BittenByDesign · 1 year ago

I got to look through the shiny new book at the store yesterday (yay for previews) but the first thing I noticed was that the cover is already coming off. Not good. I think I will photocopy the rules and use them to protect my book from unnecessary flipping.

I noticed auspex were gone. shame, I really liked the cheap price and the fact it kept infiltrators well away from my squads. Hellfire rounds for characters is nice, but really the aux grenade launcher is power/artificer armour only? Come on. That weapon would be an excellent addition to a terminator captain. In fact, I have an old termie capt. with one mounted on the back of a power fist...

So there is no upgrade for sergeants to veteran as they are considered vets already. Fine. No real choice wargear wise for them is a shame.

But I do like the idea behind special characters and the fact white dwarf may get more of them....

gc · 1 year ago

$30 for the new codex...WOW!

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

it's still 25 until the 20th. so if u havent, better preorder it now....

Dragonlv8 · 1 year ago

Yay, Marines will now make more sence :p
Some of this looks really good some of this.
16pts a marine isn't a bad thing (well i play BT so im used to it).

Joe · 1 year ago

Are DA's willing to pay 16 points per marine and having BS 4 chappies and librarians?

I agree, in theory, it's all more or less the same, and it's kinda bogus that it doesn't work that way. But, if GW were to update some of the wargear, they would have to update some point values, and stat lines, etc. - and that would pretty much be a new codex.

Now, in a friendly game, I'd probably let my DA friend use a LRR, or have Heavy 2 cyclones (for more points, maybe). That's a friendly game though, in a tourney, I'd expect my opponent to use their RAW, and I would hope that my opponent wouldn't expect anything diffferent (OK, I'd probably let DH use the Hvy 4 Rending Assault Cannon, they need the help).

The reason they're not going to issue FAQ's is that it's not as simple as "Use the 2008 Codex: Space Marines (Hurr!) for the following items: Storm Shields, Assault Cannons, Land Raiders and all variants, Razorbacks and all variants, etc."

I don't know about you, but I don't want to see my BA friend fielding 3 Baal Predators and another 6-8 Razorbacks with twin AC. And I don't want to see a BT army with 30 assault marines armed with storm shields (with a few power fists thrown in for good measure).

Hey, I feel for DA, BA, and BT players. But it is what it is. You're free to use the new SM and have green, red, or black and white marines. In fact, you can even use the CSM codex and have renegade and extra-spiky (and more skull-covered) green, red, or black and white chaos marines!

Stop crying about what is fair or not fair to you. It's a freaking game! Think about what is fair for your opponent, and if it's not clear what you should be using - offer to use the most restrictive rules. It's about having fun, not designing the uber-death-army and having fun at others expense.

Chumbalaya · 1 year ago

It isn't about having the most ubar armiez evar!!!1one! Consistency is all we wanted. Why is a blue storm shield is suddenly more awesome than a red or white storm shield? For the same points cost no less?

And yes, I would take the good with the bad. Nerfed scouts (even if they stayed elites), nerfed Chaplains, nerfed Librarians (combined with the DA powers you will never, ever, ever see Librarians again), more expensive marines and so on.

If anything, DA and BA can be incorporated into the big book, much like the Chaos Codex. Add some special characters here and there and you're done.

Like so:
Azarael (Master stats, same rules otherwise)-allows something Dark Angely in exchange for combat tactics (stubborn? intractable?), all Termies/Bikes exchange combat tactics for Fearless, Scouts, etc.
Belial (Captain stats, relic blade)-Makes Terminators exchange combat tactics for Fearless, make them Troops, limits squad size, and allows one Apoth/Standard
Sammael (Captain stats, nifty jetbike or speeder)-Makes Bike Squadrons Troops and they exchange combat tactics for Scouts and locater beacons (Fearless?), allows Apoth/Standard
Asmodai/Sapphon (current Interrogator-Chaplain stats)-some rule reflecting the hunt for the fallen or a feared reputation
Ezekiel (Libby stats)-Weaken Resolve/FotD

There, you've successfully incorporated the DA Codex into the marine book while still maintaining the importance of the chapter. You could probably even take out Belial and Sammael in favor of using a Bike mounted Captain and a Terminator Captain making Terminators Troops.

Same could work for BA, BT, and even SW. That way the marines are done justice with a suitably beefy book, we have less marine releases and get other races done, and we open up a new way to make themed armies: Using special characters to promote variant lists. You could even bring out optional rules in WD to do the same for other armies (especially Chaos).

Lord · 1 year ago

However everyone hated the chaos book because of that. GW will eventually revamp the other chapters, starting with Space wolves (according to the rumors) also, why are you complaining about minor chaptors, when they have relativly new rules (for Blood angels, Dark angels, and army of death) when stuff the the Deamonhunters has not been given a new codex since 3rd edition.

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

then you would end up with a 250 page codex that costs 100 bucks.

u wanna buy a book that expensive? sure be my guest....

u wnna carry that thick of an armybook? sure be my guest....

and why are you all being whiny abt the new codex? PK said at GDLA that there will be no FAQ's for the units iirc.... that does not rule out an FAQ for wargear, or a white dwarf update for the other 3 marine books (SW are getting a codex soon)....

if all marine armies are the same on the basic level then whats the fun playing them? so you want a Death-Raven army with Stern-Van thrown into the mix, with 4 LR's?

YES: one terminator squad in the army can choose a LR as a dedicated transport.

so you want a BA assault army that takes AM's as troops, VAS and jump-pack DC as elites and Vanguard for fast attack, and Baal Predators and LRRs??? oh look, i massacre u in assault. oh look, i massacre you in shooting. what a balanced game isnt it?

so you want a BT army with emperor's champ, 20-man troop choices, Stern-Van, cheaper MM bikes, LRC and LRR, and oh look, we are ALL FEARLESS with our vows!!! perfectly balanced game....

(I may have made some errors in the examples above since I'm not familiar with how BT/BA/DA work exactly, but I do hope that the point gets across)

for all the complainers abt not getting the new options and what not - you can do things, either ask opponent's permission abt using the new wargear rules, or just suck the new codex up until u get a redo. you can't have all the new things, and a divergent codex that made u much superior to basic marines in 4th ed at the same time.

Lord · 1 year ago

The other option is ask your oponent, if you can use a mixture of codexs. ie BA/DA/BT special units, in a regular SM army.

Chumbalaya · 1 year ago

The book as-is is 150 pages, they can successfully incorporate the current incarnations of the BA and DA with maybe 10 more (most of that being fluff, all you need is special characters to represent their divergences).

As it is, this Codex is taking a lot of things away from the supposedly unique chapters and leave them with very little. DA have Fearless Terminators and Scouting Bikes, BA have Vanguard without Heroic Intervention that use up an elite slot, Baals, and mandatory DC. Everything else goes to new marines, often with more options and for cheaper. That's lame.

As for mix and match, you can do that with the book anyway. Marneus and Kantor make for scoring Sterns and stubborn across the board plus choosing to pass or fail all Ld tests. It looks balanced because all that stuff costs a lot of points and a decent sized army can't possibly incorporate it all. By adding in the BA/DA characters you open up more options for marine players (gamers, DIY-er, DA/BA purists), keep things consistent.

Not looking for a game advantage, I would like to have ==My== Codex not made virtually obsolete only a year after its release.

abhinavjain · 1 year ago

really? each entry in YOUR codex that is different from MINE is gonna need a fluff page... YOUR chapter is also gonna need some fluff pages....

ur telling me that BA/DA/BT codexes can be rendered down to 10 pages of info? i dont know abt any1 else, but i wud find it insulting if that happened...

each codex is unique in its own way... we regular marines have some advantages over you right now... what you basically want is all those advantages plus the ones you already get... death-raven, death company, 20-man troops and god knows what else....

i hate to say this but you sound like a whiner if you think your "4th ed." repeat "4th ed" is out of date.... SW/Necrons/IG/BT have even older codexes... are they not obsolete?

and why are you all being biased towards regular marines anyways? you guys all get cool stuff in ur codexes that we didnt have in 4th ed... seems like ur looking for the ROYALE WITH CHEESE here... forget it dude... codex marines needed something definitive that clearly set them apart from all you divergent guys... and we got it... it happens to be better than what you have at the moment so you feel the terrible, gnawing urge to complain and whine about it.... got only one thing to say --- suck it up and shut up or get out of the hobby if you cant handle it.....

and personally, i wud like to see you try to incorporate 5 codexes into 1 (C:SM, BA/DA/BT/SW)

Tattoo Dan · 1 year ago

Hey this may not be really related to the new Marine codex but did any one else noticed that they updated the free Blood Angel codex online for 5th edition ?

Says on the cover : "Revised and updated for the 5th edition of Warhammer 40,000"

Grahg_the_Elfmuncher · 1 year ago

No he hasn't. You probably confusing it with chaplain Cassius, who has FnP as well as T6.

Joe · 1 year ago

I'd be very happy if they consolidated all the Space Marine (hurr!) variants into one chapter. Even if they did two codeci: Codex and Minor Divergence (Sallies, White Scars, Ultras, BA, DA) and a second Major Divergence (BT and SW). And I play Space Wolves, about the most divergent chapter. But, it's not going to happen, it's too established and profitable to have at least seven colors of marines (blue, green, red, grey, black and white (but not white and black), silver (GK's), and extra spikey (CSM)). But, it's not going to happen.

Instead, I'll enjoy all the abuse I can get out of the current SW and new SM codex.

somnicide · 1 year ago

it's also worth mentioning that the machine spirit can fire at a different target.

Excal · 1 year ago

well, just speaking out as a BT player; sure, us BT are the only chapter to be able to field LRC as transport options as well as heavy support choices. and also, the standard cost for a normal SM is 16 points, with the ability to use CC and BP or just bolter with nothing else. well, rightous zeal is accounted for, so i guess that balances out the cost of nades for C:SM units. and we also get our vows....and the emperor's champion...and the use of drop pods.

sure, i guess when i look back and re-read the BT codex, we get lots of special rules, such as drop pod assault even if its not listed, etc etc. and i guess i was pretty irked/angry that some of the war gear are totally different. as mentioned in an earlier post, as an example, sure DA get better shotguns, but at least its listed as a reason why: manstopper rounds.

main point here: i'm not really complaining, but i just want an explanation (from GW, not from fluff, arguments, or any of that stuff) saying why a UM stormshield is better than say a BA storm shield, at least make a separate entry (ei, tower storm shields, gives +3 invul save due to its great height vs storm shield, +4 invul save in CC) as to avoid confusion, and as seen on this board, lots of angry customers.

finishing comments are to all players using independent codexes for SM, just chill and wait until the new C:SM coded comes out. maybe they'll tell us something from now till then, maybe GW has heard the angry masses and do release a faq. for now, it'll suck in the short run, but in the long run, have a lil bit of patience.

also, i heard that other races are getting new codexes first, ei IG, Necrons, DE. SW codex is slated last (at least thats what the GW people told me when i asked them about it)

signo93 · 1 year ago

i didn't understand, strm shield gives 3+ invulnerable throw against melee amd fire attack?

abinavjain · 1 year ago

yes SS give 3+ invul against shooting and also in close combat.

that's one of the main reasons for the inter-chapter flame war going on in this thread.

What I would like to see happening is the BoLS admins stepping in and making a stand here.... too many ppl are bitchin and complaining and too many ppl are being alright insulting here...

if you (not you signo) cannot act maturely on the internet then just get out of here... most of the people here are mature (i would at least hope so) and as such none of us need to get into a shouting match here. that's the biggest problem on the internet... that whole anonymity thing.... /sigh

atreides · 1 year ago

Hold on a minute, all of you... Chapter Masters and Captains can have digital weapons? I know what they did in Rogue Trader and 2nd. What do they do now?

DRUMS11 · 1 year ago

If you haven't looked at the Advanced Orders on the GW site recently, Codes: Space Marines is now $30US.

TheLuc · 1 year ago

with this codex it is sure BA/DA/BT will have a adjustment of some sort, seriously all marine players out there rejoice as you get new toys, not like the chaos marine codex that has a been ripped off bad. in 5th ED so far the basic rule set is alot better imo since gameplay is a bit faster but the problem remains that the game balance will be all messed up by the codex and surly new ones that will come out.

GW best move so far is the assault on black reach box otherwise that they still do same mistakes over and over, forcing the player to change instead of adding is bad business and removing or squat treatment is as bad too.

i got my lesson with GW, collect as basic as possible, and play generic stuff otherwise that you will get ripped off, exemple 1996 chaos dex ( the way i collected ) after that the 3.1 came out most chaos players changed and got specialized and now 5th ed codex that is mostly a roll back to the 1996 codex. same goes with the marines.

captain and chappy is always a good choice, librarians since they never sold that much receive a boost get nerf after, and here we go again. the new razorback options will be popular and are also very sensible to change so keeping the old setups are a safe bet but the new weapons options hmmm i would not trust that.

special chars, those are still worthless super rules to sell, nothing more

all the vets varients are a no good too as it is clear the prupose of those is to sell metal minis, expensive and big bucks for GW

new scouts, those are a joke and a bad one, minis are great but are subject to change again.

this dex is all new and shiny but not really new so guys be careful don't go haywire on it, keep those precious buck in your pockets

DrFlop · 1 year ago

A message to all terminators: Look out for the new and improved pariahs. Terminators have 3+ invulnerable what? 8D

3dken · 1 year ago

Everyone! Go here for Games Day UK 2008 photos. All I can say is OMFG!!!!

Savark · 1 year ago

10 men tactical squads are 170pts standard

JTF · 1 year ago

I was rather irritated to see the new rules about Terminator heavy weapons, because I bought and constructed a box of Terminators before reading that and now have a currently unusable squad, but regardless of what the miniutae of the Sternguard squads are I'll be alright. I unearthed about ten figures that were just Marine torsos and legs yesterday and now have a servicable squad of Sternies ready to go

rodders · 1 year ago

got hold of my codex yesterday and they rock

but whilst some units have had a dramatic pric cut others are more expensive :(

i expect to see lost of landraider redeemers forging ahead at cruising speed with machine spirit assault cannons blazing